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Sony Venice 6k vs Alexa LF 4.5k (5 replies and 15 comments)

Vanniyan
4 months ago
Vanniyan 4 months ago

Dear master roger and david Mullen what is the difference between sony Venice and Alexa LF camera. Sony Venice 6k resolution and Alexa LF only 4.5k resolution. But still Alexa is the top of the list. Alexa beat the sony Venice.  Alexa LF Rental also high compare than sony Venice. I think resolution is not only enough. Master roger and david what's your thoughts about both cameras? 

Roger Deakins
4 months ago
Roger Deakins 4 months ago

What is the true resolution? What the sensor is capable of capturing sounds great but what is outputted from the camera is often not the same. And, as you say, resolution is not only a pixel number.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Master roger What is the proper way to find out true resolution.They are just say 6k resolution.

dmullenasc
4 months ago

You'd have to shoot line resolution chart tests using the same sharp lens on both cameras. But I've always thought it would be tricky to do that correctly in a scientific manner.

dmullenasc
4 months ago

If the actual numerical value wasn't important, then simply shooting a fine line resolution chart like you see in photo camera review sites and comparing the two would tell you which one was resolving fine detail better, though at that level of detail you start to see aliasing artifacts that give the false impression of detail.

Roger Deakins
4 months ago
Roger Deakins 4 months ago

Use your eyes! I don't know of a better way.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Thanks master. Just one more question do you think there is outputted from the camera not same for both! They just said 6k. It's published resolution. But I don't know effective true resolution. Do you judge resolution by eye. No need for any method of test? You can tell the difference. You are the master.

dmullenasc
4 months ago
dmullenasc 4 months ago

Sure there are charts that can be shot to measure recorded line resolution, same as for measuring sharpness of lenses. But I've never shot such a test, never had needed to. If I ever did, it would only be to satisfy some intellectual curiosity, it wouldn't have much practical value.

I'm sure both cameras produce images of similar resolution that is adequate for most any application.

6K and 4.5K just refer to the number of horizontal photosites in the sensor, and the corresponding file size of the raw image being recorded -- not the recorded amount of measurable detail. The design of the optical low pass filter will have an effect on measurable detail, as well as the lens used, and the recording format (if not raw.) And even the raw conversion software may have an effect.

The only way it might matter is if you were working on a Netflix series with a mandate to shoot on a 4K camera and you planned on heavy cropping in order to do a lot of image stabilization and reframing, and even then, it would mainly matter to Netflix if you had to stay at 4K or higher. In that case, you'd have more ability (by their rules) to crop if you started with a 6K or 8K recording.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Thanks David Mullen. So if any camera The design of the optical low pass filter will have an effect on measurable detail, as well as the lens used, It means all 6k camera not recording and outputting measurable detail what they mentioned 4k or 6k. So lens and optical low pass filter also important factor right?

dmullenasc
4 months ago
dmullenasc 4 months ago

For example, look at these tests at Digital Photography Review -- I selected a Nikon Z6 versus the similar Sony A7III, both 24MP cameras.  If you use the zoom feature and look at some of the fine line charts, the Sony seems to have marginally better detail but there is also color aliasing artifacts at that level, which probably means that the Nikon Z6 is using a stronger optical low pass filter to correct that, but at the sacrifice of some fine detail. So it's a trade-off.

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=nikon_z6&attr13_1=sony_a7iii&attr13_2=apple_iphonex&attr13_3=apple_iphonex&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=jpeg&attr15_3=jpeg&attr16_0=100&attr16_1=100&attr16_2=32&attr16_3=32&normalization=full&widget=1&x=-0.2786820166732831&y=-0.06379208505611342»

https://www.rogerdeakins.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Screen-Shot-2020-11-17-at-2.41.43-PM.png
dmullenasc
4 months ago

Ultimately shoot your own tests, whether real world objects like faces, or charts, or both, and make a choice as to which you like better. And keep in mind that movies don't shoot scenes of charts.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Master roger did you mention about Outputting 4K or HD images to Viewfinder? If it's not what do you mean outputting!

The Byre
4 months ago
The Byre 4 months ago

With the Sony, you have to pay extra for licenses for FF and anamorphic (so check what is included) and you have to either use E-mount lenses or an adapter and there is no internal recording for RAW.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Paying extra amount is rental house responsibility. In india sony Venice 30000INR/ per day. May be they have bargain package for movie! I think sony Venice is alternative option who unable to shoot alexa full frame in big budget.

The Byre
4 months ago

The difference in price is not that great. $42k/$58k for the bare body.

I can understand someone buying or renting a decent S35 6K camera for under $10,000 that takes standard lenses, but the Venice is over $40,000 and has their funny lens mount and if you buy one, FF costs extra - so why bother?

Vanniyan
4 months ago

Can anyone suggest cheap and best full frame camera and lenses!

dmullenasc
4 months ago

"Cheap and best" should never be used in the same sentence together.

Vanniyan
4 months ago

I am sorry. Our people use that sentence in everyday life. Is there any different meaning for that sentence.

dmullenasc
4 months ago

If best were cheapest then no one would spend money on something more expensive that was worse. As for the "best cheapest" product, what is best and what is cheap is subjective. For one person, anything over $1000 is too expensive but for another person, anything under $30,000 is fine, and what does "best" mean? Best for what? For who?

dmullenasc
4 months ago

If you had asked "what is the best camera for under X dollars" then there might be shot at making suggestions but even then, I don't know what qualities matter more, what features are needed, etc.

Mike
4 months ago

Vanniyan,
The Arri Alexa seems to be the most sought after camera these days although there are many cheaper cameras on the market that can hold their own against the Alexa.
Most of these cheaper cameras provide quality images using the right lens but as soon as they leave the factory their electronics are updated making the original camera obsolete or less fashionable as most wannabe DPs like to be ‘seen’ using the latest spec model. Secondly, most these cheaper cameras are made of plastic making them unsuitable for professional use being vulnerable to damage. Before buying a camera you will have to determine the longevity of the camera, many people buy second hand due to money restraints but still expect the camera to be in perfect Working order. They are learning tools after all and will be replaced once the owner discovers that it’s not the tool for them as it doesn’t create ‘cinematic‘ movie images’ .Having swopped their camera for a newer model they then discover that’s it’s the lighting that’s falling short, not the camera. Learn lighting techniques first and then decide what camera to buy within those financial parameters is the best way to go.
The best cheap camera to buy is the Arri Alexa, they are now flooding the market, some are high mileage but still work well as some have been updated to new specs. Old models can be bought for $5,000, ex rental ofcourse but still got a few more years left in them. All Alexa’s have alloy die casting bodies and built to last. If you buy one make sure it has a service sheet which should list the modifications and upgrades. Sockets and PCBs can be replaced if faulty But if the sensor Has problems then it’s going to be a large loan from the bank. It doesn’t matter what camera you using now, you will eventually buy or rent an Alexa at some point. They are coming onto the market so grab one while you can. They are the best and are cheap!

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